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--- meetings:2025-11-02 [2025/11/03 17:30] – ops_mgr
+++ meetings:2025-11-02 [2025/11/03 20:50] (current) – ops_mgr
@@ Line 3: / Line 3: @@
 ===== House Members Attendance: =====
-Alex, Alice, Bailey M (Spade), Bailey W (Star), Carina, CJ, Cheng, David, Ella, Fay, Jessi, Kaycie, Mae, Matthias, Olivia, Rowan, Ruth, Sidney,
+**Eevee, Alice, Rowan, Bailey, Shane, Olivia, David Quik, Owen, Vic, Alex **
 ===== Associate Members Attending: =====
-Lauren, McAllen
+**Ella, Kaycie, Caleb**
 ===== Non-Regular Attendees: =====
+**David M, Nick**
 ===== Personal Check-ins =====
@@ Line 29: / Line 28: @@
 ====== Officer Check-ins ======
-**Archivist: ** \\ **Bookkeeper: ** \\ **CHEA Rep 1:** \\ **CHEA Rep 2:** \\ **Culture Coordinator:** \\ **Food Planner:** \\ **Grounds Coordinator:** \\ **Kitchen Kaiser:** \\ **Labor Czar:** \\ **Maintenance Coordinator: ** \\ **Mastodon Overblower: ** \\ **Meeting Chair: ** \\ **Membership Coordinator: ** \\ **Minutes Taker: ** \\ **Steward: ** \\ **Treasurer: ** \\ **NP Rep: ** \\ **Operations Manager: **
+**Archivist: ** \\ **Bookkeeper: ** \\ **CHEA Rep 1:Owen - Have we put up the new chea rep page? I have a lingering to do which is to coordinate with la rey for the new NP properties rep. I commit to doing that this week. ** \\ **CHEA Rep 2:** \\ **Culture Coordinator: ****Kaycie **- **I helped with a little mediation. The culture coordinator is up for nomination. If anyone wants to sign up, I think that would be good!** \\ **Food Planner:** \\ **Grounds Coordinator:** \\ **Kitchen Kaiser:** \\ **Labor Czar:** \\ **Maintenance Coordinator: ****Owen - 3 contractors came out to do an assessment to get their bids. David and I narrowed down some other options that are best for the house so ill be contacting more people and getting more bids. We should have some options and a ballpark of what the potential project for kicking off. ** \\ **Mastodon Overblower: Olivia - ****I need to get my access restored because of the unruly of two factor authentication. It says to speak to the administrator. ****David M: me and Cory have the ability to do that. ** \\ **Meeting Chair: ** \\ **Membership Coordinator: Bailey - ****Fay moved out on friday. Her room is all cleaned out. The sign up sheet for that room is on that table and I took that down. We didn't get anybody on our waitlist who seems super interested. I posted on facebook.**
+**Shane: how many hundies is it a month**
+**Bailey: $1046 **
+**David: how should we handle ella**
+**Bailey: Ella's membership **
+**Ella: I won't be back until it's light outside. **
+**Ella: I paid my associate membership in july and they said that counts for November. Bailey I noticed the beans birthday sign. I'm going to have to make those cookies again. ** \\ **Minutes Taker: ** \\ **Steward: ** \\ **Treasurer: Eevee - ****Working with David to get the treasurer accounts in my information. I communicated with alice and Tokyo about payment plans.** \\ **NP Rep: ** \\ **Operations Manager: David M- **  **The past 2-3 weeks I have been spending a lot of time facilitating fay moving out and that whole contract. My understanding is the move out process has been going smoothly. I have been spending time working with Owen on the kitchen stuff and coordinating with the contractor at la reunion. Addressing the rats is $45,000 so ive been doing that stuff and some back end stuff with the grease trap. I'm staying fairly busy but if anyone has any projects or ideas they would like to work on. After maintenance, I want to focus on onboarding and education and whatever we can do to support you as a membership. **
 ====== Wiki Updates & Announcements ======
@@ Line 54: / Line 65: @@
 </WRAP>
+===== Agenda Item 1 =====
+(Jessi ) Discuss getting coffee maker and how to pay for it
+===== Agenda Item 2 =====
+(Jessi ) David needs further accommodations
+===== Agenda Item 3 =====
+(Jessi ) Vote to give mae accommodations for labor holiday
+===== Agenda Item 4 =====
+(Owen) Talk about hate, possibly adopt an anti hate resolution
+people vote to discuss (didnt get the names sorry will do it next time!)
+Owen: These conversations are never easy or comfortable. I believe it was Thursday when i was finishing labor and I witnessed an event: a group of people in the house (this involves Alice) and after distributing taco bell and getting back late. I am a witness and bringing witness to a house consciousness level to which I believe is hate. READS SLACK. This is literal hate. I am so glad to hear our new member Paris hates jessi and david as much as i do. The non verbal communication where people feel retracted and i guess the word would be not safe. What it also indicates is a personal hate agenda and an alliance building from hate and feeding dramas. I believe when we witness hate especially in the cooperative - if you see something say something. There is a need for accountability for this. Alternatively, if someone was going off on a diatribe about something racist, homophobic, anti jewish, it would be dealt with immediately. I was alarmed that nature seemed like regular interactions. I think just keeping the conversations broader about hate and this opens up the house to have a discussion. Have I witnessed hate? There have been people confiding in me and so what I am doing for the group I am putting myself out there. I know I will receive tension but I am willing to take that so everybody can step forward. Retribution will come to me. This is an opportunity for you to weigh in on this topic. Our core values: radical acceptance. That could be all over the board. As a collective, we seek to find humanity in others. We are in resource sharing for the common good with minimal drama. That is what I witnessed, elevating that to a group discussion so we feel like we can say what we need to.
+Alice:I want to clear up a couple of things, don't bring Tokyo into this. Her name is not Paris. She is not involved in this shit she just agreed with what i was saying. A lot of what you were quoting me on but i do not say the word bastard i probably said asshold. Third, I do think a lot of men in the house have been shitty.People have come forward. I feel justified in saying that. Me saying i hate jessi and david. I was super drunk, not an excuse. David and jessi and i have had problems from past issues. That's where that came from. Otherwise I try not to get involved in this stuff but I am also not going to talk shit behind their back. I have been open with David and jessi.
+Bailey: I am going to be open. I have had several people come up to me this week and have shown me what's on slack. They are not uncomfortable with Alice but with the way it was handled and the language about narcissists. Alice has had a lot of negative experiences with David and jessi. We have had conversations about some of the behaviors. I have been assaulted by 3 men in the house and I don't appreciate those things being roped into this. This could have been handled in a different way. We have processes for these things like talking to the mediator. It goes against our wiki and people have come up to me and said they feel scared with the language he used. Be cool and be nice to each other. You don't need to post on slack and say Alice is a narcissist.
+Stack closed
+Eevee : Trying to do this as professionally and without adding my personal feelings. Owens' grievance is someone saying they hate another person. This hate is because of a personal situation. It is because of history. This is irrelevant to hate speech. I don't care if you are a physician. It is childish, bullying, rude and manipulative to address our community and say we have a diagnosis. This should never happen again in this house. I had a grievance with Owen. He was saying how people far left and far right are not the same. Me thinking about the exact positions. I address my grievance directly to him. He listened and we moved on. That is exactly what should have happened. You should have acted in the moment as a calm member instead of roping all of us in your problem. I am exhausted thinking about this because I am concerned with Owen. That is unkind. I am very open to discussions of hate and treating each other with respect. This can not happen again. You don't really give a shit generally. If you did this to me, we would have much bigger problems. That was the pot calling the kettle black. That is ridiculous.
+David: We are attracted to negativity versus positivity. I have some things at stake. I want us all to do our best to work together as a community. Remember civility is important.
+Olivia: I wasn't there so I can only speak on my impressions. Venting in a common space lacks tact and is unkind but it doesn't feel like it was trying to disrupt David and Jessi's lives but I wasn't there so I don't have a full picture. I do feel that the slack positing does cross the lines of disrupting the right for a member's right to live here. We have a mediation process. In terms of personal conflicts, they don't usually go on the agenda. A special meeting is set aside for it partly because sometimes Sunday is 6 days away. A community conversation can be called sooner. The mediation process should have been used rather than slack
+David: Dealing with the issues at hand, before we throw it into a personal game, i think the idea in mind of hate whatever that is to the individual. The point on the agenda item is to put an anti hate resolution. This is your goal. To put that out there - I want to be proactive at the same time, the goddess is a place, compassion is a place, no matter where going through mom heals all. I'm just going to say it like this. The entire incident is a personal issue. The idea is to stop the hate. I don't want any hate. That is a wish from me. I don't want hate from anyone here. How we're going to do that is a new agenda point. If that's the idea, if you want to make a resolution. Is your idea to bring a motion forth.
+Bailey:The agenda item doesn't seem true to the language. A direct answer to your characterization. I don't feel like we're talking about the agenda item. It doesn't seem like we want to anti hate when we're pointing fingers at alice and calling her a narcissist.
+Owen: be a body instead of reacting
+Vote to extend an item 10 minutes:
+Vote - 5:2:4
+David opps: it sounds like the stated goal is not the direction we are going. I am not putting a blame on anyone. This back and forth tells me we won't come up with a resolution at this meeting. It is important to come to a resolution in some manner. Trying to move the ball forward so it doesn't fester. It is important to try to address these issues in some form or faction so they don't fester and people are not feeling heard. I think that has a negative effect on everyone involved. I don't have any answers but I am trying to hear perspectives. How can we address these grievances and come to a deeper understanding to work through things. I am hoping that tonight there is an idea of how we move forward. Maybe the mediators? Nothing comes of this.
+Caleb: I think that i joined sasona in july. I could sense tension in the house. There was no cohesion and I picked up on factions. The fact that we are talking about interpersonal conflict might be good. I feel grateful for the opportunity to be able to speak our truths and I hope we will be able to think about next steps. Can we use this unfortunate situation to build greater resilience as housemates? Is this salvageable? I am happy we are able to speak about it but not the circumstances.
+Shane: boxing gloves and beer. Quit bitching about. Talk about it outside. This is all a facade. Ugh slack. Are we retarded? No, we are actually very smart. If you have beef, throw on some gloves and go outside. Best time to be alive
+Owen: I hear your perspectives. The method I communicated there was a lack of tact. It concerns me that there is hate that has been couched under personal history and its still hate. I am not talking about hate speech. Perhaps i do not have the right division but what i witnessed “im so glad our new member tokyo hates jessi and david a smooch as i do” there is history and there is a coalition building around hate. I want to not have that happen. I want that to be like Caleb is saying there is some sort of a subtone here. While I tend to be brash, it's acknowledged there is hate and I want to air that out. I want us to have radical acceptance not factionalization.
+Rowan: It might sound pessimistic and I don't consider myself a pessimistic person at all. I feel like living in a house with 17 people. I feel like I was kind of addressing Owen.
+David: what just happened as a meeting chair is unacceptable. This right here is weird. You were blocked.
+Rowan: they weren't blocking me
+David: try not to do this to others when they are in the middle of the point
+Olivia: its my understanding that Starr is trying to give Owen context. There is context that should be asked for. The things Alice expressed don't go in a vacuum where she woke up one day and said "I want to form a hate-based coalition. I'm also friends with them and I would like to be with Owen. There might be extra context when things don't add up. You have the right to say no i dont feel like telling you. No one can know whether someone can say yes if no one asks you. The way that alice was saying didn't come in a vacuum and you need to ask
+Owen: I acknowledge this
+Olivia: I have noticed the word unacceptable has been used. It is a cousin of the passive voice. Lets use iMessages : I feel disrespected by this. You weren't the first person to use it this meeting. It's helpful for you guys to hear how I am feeling versus a person watching from above. I would be sitting above everyone. All I can say is what I feel. I do like that they were talking.
+David: I never say unacceptable. This had to do with respect. I understand why the step out happened. I am not sure if anything was received. My unacceptable is whatever you got going on there is someone speaking. I didn't get anything from what Rowan said. That's what I meant in this situation. I am sorry, Rowan.
+Kaycie: i want rowan to say what they are going to say
+Rowan: i dont mean to be pessimistic. I am not a person to be pessimistic often. I feel like when there is 17+ living together and seeing each other all the time, its an open membership policy, its kind of inevitable that poeple hate people. I dont talk about it - i just dont like to dwell on negative thing or let them have too much headspace. I try to avoid being part of these conversations whether it was. I wish i could leave but i feel the duty to be here. I don t think we should be scared of disliking people. Alice has tried to mediate. When it comes down to it, i dont think thats evil or narcissistic or building a hate based coalitions. It sucks for everyone - it hurts to be david and jessi. Alice brushes things off but if i was the one being called a narcissist it would be extremely hurtful to me. I dont think we should shy away
+David; rowan thank you. Bailey i did think it was inappropriate because i think rowan got kind of stomped on.
+Bailey: i disagree. I think it was fine
+Extension
+Continuing for 8 minutes: 6-3-0
+Simple majority
+David: does anyone have any ideas of a path forward? It could be accepted as this is how things are or is it a problem that we need to address or work through mediation? Does anyone have any ideas
+Rowan: this doesnt address alice and owens grievance part of things, i am not them, i think we discussed this on an agenda item. We discussed not using slack for (not sure exact word) but serious topics. Maybe there is a rule we could institute or a pinned message on slack. I would like to see something instituted: slack is for raves, information instead of in depth discussions and certainly not mediations
+David: Is there a mode to address serious topics? What is the best way to handle that
+Rowan: i think the in person is best for this. I dont like text based. It could be a community conversation. We printed out our mediation page on the wiki. This is for personal grievances: there is a list of steps from do nothing to membership review for eviction. The wiki is a vast place and i have not read the whole thing
+Olivia: that process of what to do about uncooperative behavior: where it goes from do nothing etc. further down from there - there is a set of links (some of which is printed out) non violent communication process. I raised my hand from what David said. I would say mediation but i think one of our house meetings should be non violent communication training. It should not be things we're worried about. I know meetings already run over 90 minutes. Something we used to do at the end of every meeting - you would give kudos and shoutouts. Thank you starr for telling me something that was mean. Or I could say thank you David for washing all my dishes, just kidding. We called it house love - it is built into meetings.
+David: I have found in our processes - there is practice of having to do with the comfort of something and side stepping because it's so uncomfortable. No one wants to say how it is. No matter how many ideas - people will find a way to avoid them. There would be no clear answers where it wont cause me extreme discomfort. No one wants to deal with it. We can say these ideas but to implement them, it took me a yea. I don't think people understand how important that is. We have to take action on it. I have suggested committees for things. The only thing we have had is a work group. We cant find a way. To set forth how we are going to do this, I suggest we have a work group for how to handle an emotionally charged problem and not deal with uncomfortable situations. What can officers do with what? We have issues that some people can't get too close to. I am the meeting chair and jessi is the steward. We have got to do this
+Bailey: Whenever Tyson had membership review, Olivia was steward and mediator. We don't believe the steward and meeting chair could do those things. It was decided then it would be the culture coordinator
+Eevee: our mediation process is a great start. Having everyone be aware is the first step. I agree with Rowan that conversations should be in person and I agree with David we need to see it through. Being able to do that in person is easier, fro the agenda item i would like to address the definition of hate so we can iron out. We need to be clear and address misunderstandings or gaps in person. I think we have good systems and we do need to add to them. I like Olivia's thoughts.
+Owen: I want to say I would kayak with everyone here at Ladybird. There is not a single person here who I would not invite. I don't have a personal problem with anybody. It was accurate to an extent and there is hate. I can not like them. We still collaborate. I feel like we are in social cohesion - we are taking what is a hard issue and I can feel the social fabric of us connecting on something that is difficult. I think we know each other's heart better. Forming social cohesion is a hard formula and it's present now. Counter with hate, I can't fathom hating someone. Even if there is someone who yells at me, I always look at their humanity and their spirit of contribution and what they are doing. I still hold myself in my own integrity and set firm boundaries. I try to communicate in a fax man kind of way and be professional and courteous. Despite the negativity, I would acknowledge the contributions they make to our community. This woman ran the free shop with another woman. Despite not getting along, we were able to be at the meetings. We could hold boundaries, I saw her as a woman who was very stern and her contributions. To connect with everyone's heart, that is how we overcome hate. Seek the humanity in the person and talk to the spirit of generosity.
+Olivia: this is not a membership review of anyone, this is an agenda item. If we don't have a motion, then I believe the topic has run its course.
+David: I am going to have to agree. I think we got a couple things going on with the agenda items. We have gone way past the 10 minutes past the extension. If no one wishes to continue this conversation.
+Rowan forfeits stack
+===== Agenda Item 5 =====
+(Jessi) Approve cats as esas on the dark side
 <pagemod addagenda output_before>